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GNU Taler v0.9.0 Released (taler.net)
41 points by hdhrufjdi on Feb 14, 2023 | hide | past | favorite | 26 comments


I think physical wallets might be a requirement for crypto technologies to really go mainstream. Not because of any security reasons, but because it makes it easier for the average person to understand why if they lose their private key their money/data/etc is gone. It's hard to communicate this with software wallets when every other system people use has recovery mechanisms.


Account abstraction/Smart contract wallets might eliminate that problem.

https://support.argent.xyz/hc/en-us/articles/360008828238-Gu...


People lose their traditional physical wallets all the time. Rarely does that result in total destruction of their wealth.


Exactly, because they would never carry their life savings with them in their wallet. People do things with software wallets that they wouldn't do with cash, which suggests we need better ways of conveying appropriate mental models of how these things work. Physical wallets might be a good approach, or people might treat them like debit cards instead of wallets.


No but when that happens neither will they be surprised to lose any cash that was in the wallet.


it's not that easy to put a whole wealth in a wallet


For the record, GNU Taler is not, and do not use, cryptocurrency. It is a decentralized payement system.


Is it not centralized around the exchange provider? I'm just checking into it now. There's also a strong emphasis around KYC/AML and regulatory compliance generally.

Presumably the exchange provider would be able to recover a wallet based on the KYC?


IIRC it doesn't depend on crypto, but it can use crypto. One of the cool features is that you can use different currencies/tokens.


This is from (2022)

0.9.1 was released a few weeks ago:

https://taler.net/en/news/2023-01.html


Could somebody explains or points out a ressource explaining how GNU Taler solves the double-spending problem ? Or what the design is ?

In the traditional model (banks/credit cards), you simply sign a transaction that the receiver bank will then later handle to your bank. You let bank figure out how to transfer the money. Banks are basically a huge excel sheet with all the balances of customers. To avoid banks artificially adding numbers in the excel sheet, we rely on regulations (the fact that it works or not is besides the discussion here)

In the cryptocurrency, you share that huge excel sheet and each transaction is a modification that should be approved by the majority of users. Unlike banks, it is now proved that it works and you cannot manipulate the excel sheet, meaning you don’t need regulation anymore (whether this is a good thing or not is besides the discussion here. Just stating facts).

So my question: with GNU Taller, who maintain that huge excel sheet?


From what I understand, the bank will still maintain the huge excel sheet, but you get the benifit of crypto because when they issue the "tokens" that they accept, they are double blind signed. So the bank doesn't know who bought what


So you need to setup a bank that both the sender and the buyer will use.

That’s one order of magnitude harder to do right.


Looks interesting, is it really 100% anonymous and private for the customer? Can any merchant from any country register to receive money as long as they follow tax law from their own country, or is it subject to sanctions and things like that? Could be a nice method to reach countries like Syria now that they are suffering after the earthquake but many populations aren't allowed to help them because of sanctions.


AFAIK Taler is a cryptographic gift card. You'd need to "buy" them first, but once you own them, you can sell/transfer/redeem them wherever, anonymously.


Taler is a payment system, not a currency. Transfers between individuals are not supported, only payment by individuals to merchants.


https://taler.net/en/faq.html#:~:text=Can%20I%20send%20money...

>Can I send money to my friends with Taler? Taler supports push and pull payments between wallets (also known as peer-to-peer payments). While the payment appears to be directly between wallets, technically the operation is intermediated by the payment service provider which will typically be legally required to identify the recipient of the funds before allowing the transaction to complete.


RMS calls GNU Taler “a software system for anonymous retail payments – payments from individuals to stores or individuals.” (Emphasis added)

30 seconds into this video: https://taler.net/en/news/2022-11.html


That sentence doesn't make any sense. People can become merchants whenever they want for example at flea market, then suddenly they receiving at taler works for them?


> Transfers between individuals are not supported, only payment by individuals to merchants.

This isn't a problem unless becoming a merchant is a burden by whatever process or financially.


But who is allowed to register as a merchant?


Are there any Taler exchanges that allow you to transfer real currency into Taler? The current website makes it sound like Taler is now a working service in the present, rather than a promising technology in development (which is how I've always thought of it), but I can't figure out how to use it other than the toy currency demo.


As far as I know this is a pure research project.


Glad to see GNU Taler continuing to make progress. Their focus on banks is nice but given the current regulatory posture in the US it seems like digital cash won't be inside banks any time soon.

Disclaimer: I built https://webcash.org/ as something people can use immediately. It has some important differences from Taler and it's not quite the same, nor using the Chaumian blinding technique and not backed by an institution or "peg".


This project never made any sense. Move on.


I think it is aimed towards institutions and government.




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